Are You Willing To LEARN Options

[TRMichels View Member Profile]

I was thinking about this - this morning in the shower:

The way many hunters "learn" hunting techniques - in this day and ages - is from hunting videos, TV shows, articles and seminars, and sometimes in talk forums. And the people doing the writing or speaking - are often considered "experts" - because they have killed one or more fairly good sized bucks - and received some "notoriety" for it as a result of their big buck kills.

But, many of these people hunt in conditions and/or places - that are not accessible to the average hunter, or hunt areas known to have several big bucks on them (places that my or may not charge the "average Joe" hunter.

IF (big if) they hunt under those conditions, does that make them "experts" on how, when, where and why to "hunt" the areas, and the deer, under the conditions - that average Joe's hunt???

Do they really have the experience to suggest productive "how-to" deer hunting techniques, tactics and tips???

Personally knowing many of the "been around for a while" TV personalities, writers, speakers and video personalities - I can definitively say that some of them can offer suggestions that will help the average Joe hunter, and some of them are not offering good suggestions for the average Joe hunter, who often hunts on "limited size private land" or public land - who does not have access or the money to hunt the areas many "deer personalities" hunt.

Hopefully I, because, I have hunted several years on public land, because I have been an outfitter and guided other hunters for several years, and because I have researched deer for 10 years - on areas that would be available to the average Joe hunter, can provide some information that will help you understand deer biology and behavior better, so you understand why deer move where and when they are most active, and provide you with some tactics, techniques and tips that will allow you to become more productive hunters …

This is what I try to do for you guys on the talk forums, and what I try to do in my books, articles and seminars. I want to try and help you become more productive hunters…

With that in mind - I need to ask you some questions:

1. When you hunt, do you go out to simply locate a good place to hunt any deer, to hunt bucks, or to hunt bucks with large racks?

2. When you hunt, do you go out to hunt a "particular" buck you may have seen during your scouting sessions.

3. Do you scout, and what do you look for when you scout?


God bless,

T.R.

[TRMichels View Member Profile]

Here is one way:

I've learned - through my research and the research of others - that the weather is basically the main factor that determines "when" and "where" deer are most active "every day". Knowing where and when deer are most likely to be - helps me locate deer on a pretty darn regular basis.

Say it is raining cats and dogs, and the wind is howling at 30 mph. I KNOW the deer are probably not gonna move much - so there is no sense sitting at a stand at the edge of a cut cornfield waiting for the deer to come to me - I have to figure out where they are most likely to be - and get close enough to them to get an opportunity. So, I get up and go look for areas where I think the deer will be holed up.
And, I've learned - through my research and personal experience that the deer are likely to be in heavy overhead cover if they can find it, and be in a spot that is out of the wind, maybe on the down windside of a hill or wooded area, or a low-lying area. I know this, because I've researched deer for 10 years, and hunted them since I was 12 years old. I've learned a few things in that time. Not all of it, but some of it.

Reading Seer Sign
Next, and this is very important, I've learned to know where to look for deer sign, and I've learned to understand what it means, which can tell me "when" the deer was in the area ('cause I understand why the deer was there - through scientific reseach), and when it might be in that general area again. I scout literally dozens of hours before the season, and all during the season (generally every few days).

And I look for the trails "buck" use, because in many areas they use the same basic routes each day as they come and go from their daytime core areas/bedding sites - to food sources and look for does.

Knowing bucks often use the same travel routes (and often the very same trail every day) especially the closer they get to their daytime core areas - I know that I can "pattern" their movments (predict on a semi-regular basis - just about where they will be every few days, at approximately the same time every day, as long as the rut is not on). And I look for their rub-route, and the scrapes they make, 'cause that tells me the buck spends some time along those areas. And that they will still use those same areas, even if the rut is on, on a less regular basis - as long as they don't find an estrus doe, and that as soon as the doe is out of estrus - they may still use those areas, especially the closer they get to their daytime core area (bedding site) once the doe is out of estrus, 'cause they may want to rest up for a few days.

So - the area where a buck spends the most amount of time - during daylight hours (legal hunting hours - and up to 75% of the DAY -not night) is in or near its "daytime core area". That is where you should spend the most amount of time if you want to take a "particular" (large racked???) buck.

And I find that buck's core area, by either seeing it or getting photos of it, and then reading sign, finding its rub route, and either back-tracking (usually) its rub route in the evening - until I actually find its core area, or I follow the rub route in the morning to locate the core area.

Then I setup - in a likely location - play the wind, and ambush him when he walks by. I might use scents, calls, rattling and decoys to get him in close. But, usually I can setup where he will walk by withing 25 yards of where I setup - and use nothing.

It takes bit of work, and a lot of understanding of deer behavior, which I've gained as a result of reading research papers and doing 10 years of deer research myself.

And I've learned (and devised) several ways to "cut down on the amount of time spent scouting", which can be used by the average Joe hunter - who does not have the time to spend scouting like I do. It is all in my book. But, I'm gonna give more of it away here.

"Patterning" is one of the most productive ways to kill "particular big bucks" you may see.

God bless,

T.R.

[mont974x4 View Member Profile]

With that in mind - I need to ask you some questions:

1. When you hunt, do you go out to simply locate a good place to hunt any deer, to hunt bucks, or to hunt bucks with large racks?

A. I have two places I go. One is a friends ranch where I hunt deer, any deer. I am about filling the freezer more than about chasing a big rack (although I wouldn't regret one. LOL ) The other place is in the mountains chasing elk. I had heard many reports of the elk being on the move and in the area. In this case, it is about quota and what is allowed to be hunted...cow vs. bull. Again, I am looking for meat, but won't reject a nice rack.

2. When you hunt, do you go out to hunt a "particular" buck you may have seen during your scouting sessions.

A. Last year during hunting camp I found an elk bed and saw him, and a handfull of mule deer. I did spend some effort trying to time his coming and going. When hunting deer, I just walk, or drive, until I see something promising.


3. Do you scout, and what do you look for when you scout?

Very little scouting is done, I honestly don't have the time or resources for it. However, when I am out I check for fresh scat and tracks, as I am sure we all do.

[TRMichels View Member Profile]

Because:

1. I am always looking - not just for any deer - and not just for bucks - BUT, for bucks that will score above 140, and above 170 if possible (in that area) -

2. as a result of reading the research papers of several top biologists, and the experience of my own 10 year research project into the biology and behavior of deer - I have a fairly good understanding of how they will react to the weather each day, and what activities they will exhibit during the different phases of the rut -

3. I understand the whitetails in most areas have traditional home ranges every year, with a "daytime core area" where they spend the majority of the day, and that bucks in particular, have preferred "very lightly used trails" (because there is generally only one buck using the trail, none direction, one tine per day),that they use as they leave their core areas in the evening to go out and feed or look for does, and often another "lightly used trail" they use as they go back intro their core area in the morning -AND that bucks often leave evidence of where they travel - by leaving rubs and scrapes (which is why we call it a "rub route"; and that these buck trails or rub routes often parallel the more heavily used doe trails, but may be up the hill, down the hill or in heavier cover, and that these buck trails can often be found near food sources -

4. I know that the terrain and type of habitat the deer are in often governs where they have their daytime core areas, bedding sites, travel routes and trails, and where they feed and water -

5. I realize that the hunting pressure - and type of habitat (particularly food sources) on adjacent properties - often governs when and where deer may enter or leave the property I hunt

6. I realize that the weather each day - governs to a great extent how active deer will be that day, and when and where they will be thaqt day

7. I realize that by glassing the property, from one or more areas where I can watch the enitre property to actually see deer, from high spots or roads and open areas - and by actually "field scouting" the property to look for deer sign and determine where the travel corridors, trails, buck trails, rubs, scrapes, core areas, bedding sites and food and water sources are -

I realize - I just can't gain enough information about a piece of property -from an aerial photo and a topo map - to determine the best places to hunt for deer, none the less a particular large racked buck.

So - my answer is - I would not hunt it - without doing some glassing and/or field scouting - first. And at least taking into scout where the preferred food sources are that day, which phase of the rut the deer are in, and the weather conditions that day.

Because of the way I hunt, and with my personal understanding of deer behavior - It is kind of and unfair scenario (trick question) for me - because I know weather is a big factor in when and where deer move - no matter where I hunt - I want to take into account the habitat and the wind, also the rut phase the deer are in, the amount of hunting pressure there might be in the surrounding areas, which might affect "where and when" the deer come onto the property I am on, ande Anything else that may affect deer activity that day.

I've not had a situation where I could not scout (at least a bit - say "all day" before the hunt). BUT, going in basically blind - I'd choose a site - depending on what the weather was doing the day of the hunt.

I'd go to low-lying, protected or wooded areas if the wind was above 10-15 mph - and I'd set up closer to where I think downwind-bedding areas are (the downwind side of the hill). If there was medium to heavy precipitation - I'd look to hunt near areas with overhead cover, and expect the deer not to move too far.

If it was hot I'd expect the deer to be in or near the heaviest overhead vegetation (for shade, and possibly in areas where the wind might cool them off in the shade, or in or near water (the lake or swamp if there is one). I'd also expect them to move during the cooler part of the day, with them (and me) playing the wind and thermals for morning and evening hunts.



My plans depend on how much time I have to glass, field stalk, and the sign I see - both before the hunt, and while I'm hunting - and my plans and hunting locations may change based on what occurs each day, and what I find, or see each day.

First thing I would do is, pick as many spots (up high - like I do elk hunting) as needed - to see as much of the property as I could, and glass it both sunset an sunrise - several days (or weekends) just prior to peak breeding in that area - then I'd narrow down my field scouting to the areas where I saw the biggest buck. Or - if no buck shows - possibly where I saw the most amount of doe activity, or I might just go with my "gut".

Next I'd try to hunt the week of peak scraping, or the week before peak breeding - when the bucks are still fairly predictable.

If there was hay in the fields, and if the wind in that area is primarily out of the northwest, and If I could scout the area around the property, and knowing that older bucks like to bed down on the downwind side of hills (during the day), I'd look for a rub route leading up onto any of the ridges in the area, look for a buck core area on the downwind side of those ridges, and if a stand site was close to the core area (but not in it) I'd setup there in the evening to see if the buck walks along it's rub route and get a shot at it.

Just my initial way of choosing a spot, if it doesn't work, I do more field scouting (actually looking for sign).

Although I rely to a great deal on the type of habitat and the topography - I also rely to a great extent on glassing, and a ton of field scouting - to locate prime travel routes, rub routes, scrapes, and daytime core areas (especially those of bucks).


If I can't scout at all before the hunt, I rely much more on my general knowledge of deer core aras, bedding sites and travel routes, and combine it with the use of a topo and an aerial - then choose a spot. If I don't get anything the first day, I quit hunting about 10 -12, and "still hunt/stalk" the property to look for sign - until about three hours before sunset. If I see something while "still hunting" - fine - if not I choose the best location based on what I've seen that day while scouting.

I also want to know what is in the agricultural fields, and were they cut/harvested lately - ie, if there is an alfalfa field; is it still growing up, or has it been cut and baled within the last week; or has it been cut, baled and has started to grow back - with new, lush, tasty, green growth in it? Makes a difference where I may setup.


God bless,

T.R.

[helo4him View Member Profile]

From TR:This is what I try to do for you guys on the talk forums, and what I try to do in my books, articles and seminars. I want to try and help you become more productive hunters…

With that in mind - I need to ask you some questions:

1. When you hunt, do you go out to simply locate a good place to hunt any deer, to hunt bucks, or to hunt bucks with large racks?
-- I locate a good place for deer in general and hope to find bucks. At this stage in my hunting, I am hunting anything. -SKB

2. When you hunt, do you go out to hunt a "particular" buck you may have seen during your scouting sessions
-- Not yet, but probably will someday -SKB

3. Do you scout, and what do you look for when you scout?
-- Yes, I start scouting several weeks before season, however, I don't really know what I'm looking for or how to interpret what I see. -SKB

[Titaniumman View Member Profile]

Amazing conversation starters these morning showers

[Turkey Hunter View Member Profile]

In responce to this I am generally a meat hunter and have just hunted bucks of any sort.
However in these later years of maturity I tend to wait untill the last possible moment in the season to harvest just any deer. I find it intresting to watch the different personalities of the deer.

I have 7 different buck on film the last several weeks and they are all different in personality. I do how ever have a 140 or biger 10 point on film at 70 yards and a 170 or biger what I cal I dont know because I can only count 12 pints in the film but there are more. the 10 point I have only seen once but the other one I saw 2 days in a row.

I like to look for pinch points this is where the wood and brush narrow and the bucks move through a restricted area. the problem with these is the are good when there is a lot of hunters out but on mormal routine they are slow . but durring the hieght of the rut they are hot hot hot the deer move through all the time back and forth looking for does or chasing them.

If I get a big one I will figure out how to get it posted here.
TH